TRANSCRIBED & CORRECTED VERSION:
This presentation is dedicated to
the men and women of the U.S. Air
Force, U.S. Army and NORAD (North American
Aerospace Defense Command). The producers also thank them for
their assistance in the making of this documentary. And now, the
Edwards Air Force Base Encounter. The U.S. Air
Force versus UFOs. In several of his
speeches President Ronald Reagan stated that the world could be united
if we faced an alien threat from space.
Ronald Reagan: I don't
suppose we can wait for some alien race to
come down and threaten us. Perhaps we need some outside universal
threat. Our differences, worldwide, would vanish if we were
facing an alien threat from outside this world.
Fact or speculation? Reagan
came back to that subject many
times. In California, Edwards Air Force Base is the home of the
Air Force Flight Test Center, testing manned and unmanned aircraft
weapon systems and spacecraft at the Associated
Unit NASA Ames Dreyden Research Facility. What started as
Muroc Army Airfield in 1933 was renamed for
Captain Glenn W. Edwards, who was killed there on
June 5, 1948 in the crash of an experimental jet powered
W-B 49 Flying Wing he was piloting. For years Edwards has been
the home of exotic test aircraft. But unknowns have flown there
too. Edward J. Ruppelt, former chief of an
Air Technical Intelligence Center, reported several incidents
of unidentified aerial vehicles with advanced flight characteristics,
seen over this secured test facility in the 1950s. A similar
event happened on the night of October 7, 1965. And here is the
voice of the man who first reported it.
Chuck Sorrels: My name is
Chuck Sorrels, a retired
Air Force air traffic controller. I'm recording this on May 16,
1995. In 1965, 30 years ago, I was a tech sergeant in the U.S.
Air Force, attached to the19 25th Communication Squadron at Edwards Air
Force Base in California. I was
the air traffic controller on duty in Edwards tower on the night of
October 7, 1965. I was working a midnight shift in the tower when
at approximately 1:30 a.m., I spotted a group of luminous objects in
the air above and around Edwards Air Force Base. They had a
flashing red light on the bottom, with a green, glowing light above the
They also sometimes flashed or
glowed a white light above the green
light. The sightings lasted until about daylight, 5:30 or six
a.m. At first I sighted one object, which was larger and brighter
than the rest. At one point there were seven objects visible at
the same time.
Canadian scientist, Wilbert B. Smith, who worked
with the U.S. government on classified projects, stated that luminous
objects like this were most likely extraterrestrial spacecraft.
The objects could become red or white hot from high voltages and cause
a corona discharge through the surrounding air. The unusual light
characteristics viewed at Edwards Air Force Base have been reported
many times worldwide and have been seen in recently photographed
footage of similar aerial objects.
Chuck Sorrels: The objects would
be stationary for a period of time and
then move very fast to another location and appeared to be able to
climb straight up in short order. Good eyesight and my experience
as an air traffic controller made it plain to me that these luminous
objects were not planes, helicopters, stars, satellites, weather
balloons or any other known aerial object. Your job as an air traffic
controller calls for you to be watchful. Training told me these
were not normal objects. The objects weren't supposed to be
there. These were objects out of the normal, from their
appearance and flight characteristics. I reported these sightings
to base operations and the Los Angeles Air Defense Sector. The
objects were also seen by at least five other people on Edwards Air
Force Base. They were also seen by George Air Force Base tower
and were showing up on
radar in at least four different radar sight locations.
The Los Angeles Air Defense
Sector, or LAADS, plus NORAD and other
parts of the air defense command, were very serious units, protecting
the United States from air attack. A search radar, height finder
radar, and visual sightings convinced the LAADS
people that this could be a serious situation and should be
investigated. LAADS decided to send up an interceptor to have a
look. Many locations were reporting these
objects and they didn't take it lightly. When I lined the pilot
of the interceptor up with the Edwards runway and gave him a heading
the object, he reported contact, which means he had radar contact with
something. I got a lot of razzing from my buddies on
the base for seeing these objects. When I saw them a few times on
other occasions, they weren't reported and no interceptors were sent
up. I am heard on the actual tapes you will hear from 30 years
ago. I am referred to as Edwards tower.
You are about to hear authentic,
declassified Air Force audio
recordings, edited into a chronological sequence from over six hours of
original tapes made from phone patches, base to base communications and
ground to air radio. These recordings have been electronically
enhanced for greater clarity and the conversations are those of actual
military personnel. Major Strubel, of a unit
then known as LAADS, Los Angeles Air Defense Sector of ARADCOM (?),
U.S. Army Air Defense Command, is heard
authorizing the making of these tapes.
Yes, sir? This is Major Strubel. I'm on with you.
Uh, the, uh, man just went to get the tower boy there so he would have
somebody to confirm his story.
Well, uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] record on---
They are. They've got
Oh, you've got it? Okay.
They're recording. [WORD?].
Recording from position [SOUNDS LIKE: INV three five] on the
[SOUNDS LIKE: It's moved] to the north of us
and [OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: one's
comin'] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] pretty fast.
[OVERLAPPING] And are he's comin' from north to south?
[OVERLAPPING] North to south?
North to south at this time from
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 4
Right. He's blinking red [OVERLAPPING] and [OVERLAPPING] which--
I have another red light and, uh, green light combination in sight
moving very rapidly over the field at this time. I--I'm
gonna check on my RAPCON to see if they have any movement in that area.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Okay.]
[SOUNDS LIKE: VSS, uh.]
Yes. Uh, LAADS, here. Say, do you all
have any, uh, reports of unknown...mmm...flying objects over
Okay. Was wonderin'. We supposedly are having quite an
invasion over here. [LAUGHS]
[LAUGHS] What area? [SOUNDS LIKE: In our] area?
Uh, no. It's over around, uh, Victorville and Edwards. [SOUNDS
LIKE: Uh,] I was wondering if any of your, uh, sites or any of
your bunches over there have called anything in.
No. Uh uh.
Thank you much.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Got four of 'em in that "V"?]
Uh, three on the bottom side and two others.
Yes, sir. Counting that, craft-- So there's four all together.
There's two in a line and there's
three in a line.
The three in line, uh, would run westward.
And the other one would run up and parallel with the bright one.
[OVERLAPPING] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] Yeah.
Is that what you're seeing?
[SOUNDS LIKE: Yeah. That's] the one I saw.
Would you do us a favor?
[OVERLAPPING] We're looking for about seven UFOs.
[OVERLAPPING] Well, maybe [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
[OVERLAPPING] Uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] uh, [SOUNDS LIKE:
from] Ontario International.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Uh, would you--]
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: North] of Ontario [WORD?].
positive. Uh, this is coming from Edwards and George.
[OVERLAPPING] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] here. Look, uh--
LIKE: Did he come from the northeast?]
Yes. No. He
came from the.... Yes. Uh, northeast.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 6
Or about seven of 'em. [WORD?] we had white, green, flashing
lights and we had them sighted visually.
And they're climbing now. And, uh, we wondered [SOUNDS LIKE: if
you're painting them-- We're trying to get a cross section here.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE]. Also the two towers, George
tower. Also, uh, uh, uh, Edwards tower.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Oh, uh, describe] it for me.
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: Sure.]
[B.G. VOICES] [OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: Okay, uh], as
near as, uh-- I watched it through, looked at it through the
glasses and it, at first appearance it just looked just like a star.
And then it started-- It was white, uh, white and green. It
keeps flashing white and green and on, uh-- It appears, what
appears might be the bottom it, it-- At first appearance it, it
looked just like a star.
I mean, they're not-- Uh, it's not intermittent flashing. It's, uh--
Appears to be [SOUNDS LIKE: slate.]
I see. In other words it, uh, like it fades in and out, huh?
[SOUNDS LIKE: And in a different flash.]
[OVERLAPPING] Flashes red,
It's a definite
Uh, it's similar to what aircraft anti-collision
lights would do.
[01:09:59:23] . .
Oh. [OVERLAPPING] I see. [SIMULTANEOUS —
UNINTELLIGIBLE] [OVERLAPPING] [SIMULTANEOUS--UNINTELLIGIBLE]
[OVERLAPPING] It, uh, it definitely isn't moving [UNINTELLIGIBLE] or
constant enough to be an aircraft.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 7
And [UNINTELLIGIBLE] around here [SOUNDS LIKE: or else it] would
dig up something.
And it, it, it's definitely, uh, changing in color from white to red or
white to green and, uh, red. Ee-- uh, the red flash is strong
enough [OVERLAPPING] it would block out, uh, the rest of it for the
So it appears to be white, from white green to red.
Can you hear any [UNINTELLIGIBLE] thing what it looks like?
I haven't checked it. It's, it's, uh, appeared to move a lot
closer to us. I last checked it with the glasses, uh--
[SOUNDS LIKE: Leaving], uh, over Edwards at, uh, eleven five,
uh. [B.G. VOICES] Edwards is observing them from the
ground. Uh, two towers observing them and, uh, we're carrying
them on height and radar. Uh, oh-- They're
flashing white, green and red. And we have a track on them, kilo
one five seven. They're heading west, uh,
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] at this time, uh, approximately, uh, 20 miles west of
Edwards at 11 five. There was a, uh--
We talked to
Center. They didn't have anything on it, but
heading west, uh,]
[OVERLAPPING] Flew through the area,
[OVERLAPPING] at 14 grand. And he had no JOY on them,
uh, Center, query the bird. Uh, let's see. I'm holding them
now. Uh, the bird that flew through the area
is 50 miles west of Edwards.
[SOUNDS LIKE: 50 ???.]
Now, uh, talked to the sergeant, uh, the YOOFO people at
Edwards, uh. In the first place I should tell that, uh, Norton
YOOFO referred us back to Edwards as being in their
area.] Uh, uh, there's a lieutenant........
uh, the YOOFO responsible
officer in bed, 30 [OVERLAPPING] miles away.
[OVERLAPPING] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] [SOUNDS LIKE: sergeant, uh,]
doesn't, uh, have any authority except just to report to us. They
haven't, uh, requested a scramble or anything. Uh, my question
would be then do you, uh, want us to, uh, shake this lieutenant out of
the pad and, uh, see if he wants to request, uh,.. Edwards said they
had no capability, uh, base ops [WORD?] going up
[B.G. BUZZER] Uh, now we're [SOUNDS LIKE: paintin' them
up there and everybody's seeing [SOUNDS LIKE: it.] So, uh,
do you think we ought to shake this lieutenant out of pad and, uh, see
if he wants to request, uh, we go up and take a look?
It might be well and-- They haven't raised him yet, huh? They
haven't called him?
Well, I told 'em to hold off until I talked
[OVERLAPPING] Yeah. Uh huh. [SOUNDS LIKE: He, uh--]
[OVERLAPPING] The sergeant's reluctant to call him until he feels like
he, uh, needs to, 'cause it bein' three o'clock in the morning.
Yeah. Uh, [SOUNDS LIKE: yeah, if you have such a good
trace] and everything on them, uh, I think it'd be worthwhile if you
give him a call.
Yeah. That's my feeling too.
And then if he, uh--
[WORD?] in that area, you know.
If he should request a, uh, scramble, uh, we could prob'ly take one of
the guard birds, uh, our deuces up,
don't you think?
Yeah. That could be okay.
Uh, all they give in here is, uh, special 13 for
Okay. Let's, uh, put a special 13 around one
Oh. One five seven.
Right. Thank you.
This is the SD. We're making kilo one five seven a special
which is the classification for unsafe targets.
tower at Edwards. We have an object now, over the
[B.G. VOICES] He is right over the field?
Right over Edwards, moving southward fairly rapidly. And
thing also has-- I can make out red and white flashing lights.
And the captain at DET ONE has confirmed this.
[01:13 : 58:03]
He can also see this?
He can also see this.
In addition to Edwards, the following air force bases were
with this event: March, George, Martin and Hamilton, where the 28th Air
Division was located. An element of the Air Defense Command,
there Major Healey gave Major Strubel and LAADS
orders. Major Strubel was called SD, for Senior Director.
Also heard on the tapes will be the Weapons Director, Lieutenant Fisk,
called WD or WD technician III, for team
three. Captain Balint, the YOOFO or UFO
officer at Edwards had real authority and no planes could be sent up
from Edwards or George for the planned mission
without his approval. Armed planes, Convair
F-106 interceptors set for immediate takeoff were called alert birds.
They may have carried nuclear weapons in the form of the AIR 2G-Genie
unguided rocket, with a 1.5 kiloton nuclear
warhead. NORAD was informed of the situation and did not request
they be further alerted unless things turned drastic.
Yeah. This is, uh, [SOUNDS LIKE: Edward SPK.] On the
three UFOs you got [SOUNDS LIKE: you're readin'] there.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 10
Uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] to, uh, uh, you can call it [WORD?]. NORAD
doesn't want 'em. I wouldn't tell 'em [WORD?] unless something
drastic happens. :
Oh. Okay. You don't want us to tell 'em?
[SOUNDS LIKE: Well, keep 'em] in the computer like you have now
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: account flush]
And, uh, if anything, you know, anything, anything
comes of this, then, uh, coordinate with us. [SOUNDS
LIKE: I mean, I
don't know what else we can do.]
Yeah. Well, uh, they are scrambling the YOOFO, uh, officer out of
the pad .
Uh huh. .
And, uh, I talked to, uh-- I don't know who's makin' the
decisions. Uh, I talked to Major Healey, uh, over at Hamilton.
Yeah. . :.
And, uh, if they, uh, request a, uh, bird to go up and take a look, we
were gonna, uh, send our, uh, Alpha Limas' up from Edwards.
Uh, but, uh, who's makin' the decision? Major Healey or you
people up there?
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] [SOUNDS LIKE: listen to the-- decisions
still come from 28th.]
Yeah. Okay. Well, uh, we'll, uh, we'll just continue with
what we're doin' then.
Right. [SOUNDS LIKE: Here and here.]
LIKE: You seeing a director between?]
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 11
Uh, this is Major Strubel.
This is Captain Balent at Edwards.
Yeah. Uh, you're YOOFO officer?
Yes, sir. .
Okay. I coordinated with my people, uh, at, uh, the, the next
level and, uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] [SOUNDS LIKE: always] let a bird
go, uh, take a look. And w-- we got the 106 available.
The directive I have says only, uh, that, uh, stick within the existing
policies, go ahead and do it. So, uh, it's, uh, it depends on
your, your policy. As far as I'm concerned it would be a good
would be a good idea.
Well, actually, uh, the way I coordinated it with, uh, my people is
we're standing by for your request.
So you [UNINTELLIGIBLE] had a
Okay. Uh, let me get the spelling on your name for my log.
Balent, B A L
B A L
E N T.
Uh, okay. And you're the YOOFO officer at Edwards?
Okay. Uh, and, uh, I guess we n-- we-- Somebody has a
number to reach you back?
Uh, I'll recoordinate this now, because it's been some time.
Uh, but we do have live data on 'em.
We should be able to pick 'em up all right. So I'll, I'll get
I'll wait for your call.
Hello. Uh, this is Captain Clark, Alpha Lima.
Okay. Captain Clark, uh, Lieutenant Reed?
Uh, we have some confirmed reports of, uh, some unidentified flying
objects your area. .
Approximately six or more, uh, from Edwards, uh, just south of
Victorville, and we'd like to use-- We have
information from 28th --- We also have some height-finder cuts from
anywhere from 3,000 up to 13. They're moving
And they're climbing slowly.
They're red, white and green flashing lights.
And, uh, they have been confirmed on radar.
Uh, we can't use any of the alert birds, but do you
have another 106?
Well, that's all we have.
That's all you have?
That's all we have, (with) six on alert.
Okay. Just a moment. I'll let you speak to the Senior
Director, and maybe I can go ahead and use one of your
alert birds. Uh, they can't establish what these things are.
Uh, [SOUNDS LIKE: just a second.
Okay, so they're still trying to decide here what to
You say you might have one? .
Well, uh, part of my [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. We had
one on [WORD?]
one hour. But I believe that's just because, uh, we
that pilot here for it.
Oh, I see.
But I'm pretty sure they're all up and loaded.
He's, uh, checking that out, the, uh, ground crew now.
If he does-- If they do it downloaded, then we could pick
If, uh, not then it, uh, we'd have to have authentication on the
scramble with, uh, the weapon aboard.
Okay. Uh, Major Strubel just wanted us to call you, the
SD, here and, and, and let you know and I'll tell you I'll call you
back in a minute or in a few minutes.
Uh, what c-- How can I reach you?
Uh, just, uh, call the, uh, hot
Okay. And [OVERLAPPING] then they'll
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: Fine.]
get me [B.C. BUZZING] back [SOUNDS LIKE: in the] [WORD?].
Okay. Thank you. I have another call coming in now.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 14
Okay, sir. [SOUNDS LIKE: Zero Romeo.]
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] [PHONE HUNG UP]
[SOUNDS LIKE: 28] [WORD?] [SOUNDS LIKE:
Yeah. Uh, Major Healey
Oh, yeah. Major Strubel here at LADDS.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Right.] Okay. They've finally
Captain Balent, ah, the YOOFO officer at Edwards out of the pad and,
uh, he said yes, he
would, uh, like to have, uh, a look. We're getting, uh, plenty
of, uh, live, uh, data and the visuals on these things
about 40 miles south of Edwards, several of them. Uh,
uh, the altitude of the ones we're measuring, uh, from four-five to
Four-five to six-six?
Yeah. Four and a half to six and a
Uh, and we have, uh, a, uh, non-loaded, uh, DET ONE -- I think it
was-- Was it DET ONE
or Alpha Lima that was, uh, available,
Reed? Lt. Reed? Was it DET ONE or Alpha
Lima? Uh, Alpha Lima at, uh, uh, a non-alert bird that they
uh, get one of their pilots, uh, in about 15 minutes.
[OVERLAPPING] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] .
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: They could?]
So, uh, we'll go ahead and take a look then, right?
Yeah. We-- Go ahead and use them and, uh,
be and be careful with low
altitudes and, uh, ground to hills and all
that stuff, uh.
Okay. We'll, uh, we'll take a look at
these [OVERLAPPING] [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
[OVERLAPPING] You still-- How many you [SOUNDS LIKE: are
painting now ?]
Uh, they're varying reports come in. We have a conference going,
uh, with Edwards tower and, uh, uh, Pedro and, uh, Boron on our heighth
(radar). And, uh, it seems to be about three, and
they're in the, uh, uh, azimuth's, uh, roughly from one five zero to
one, uh, two zero and forty miles from Edwards.
I see. Yeah.
Which, uh, puts 'em pretty close to us, but we've, we've had
people up on the roof looking, uh. I think one of our
people had some obs on them. But there are a
number of people, uh, have had visuals on 'em.
And, uh, say Edwards tower and many of
the, uh, tower people picked 'em up, uh, visually, [OVERLAPPING]
[SOUNDS LIKE: yes?]
[OVERLAPPING] Yes. They've been watching them for over an hour .
Yeah. Okay. I think it might be worth a try.
Okay. We'll, [OVERLAPPING] we'll, get this guy out of the pad and run
him up. It'll
prob'ly be a half hour before he can get there.
Okay. Use caution.
Use caution. Proper military procedures were
in place for a possible threatening situation. We will hear that the
luminous objects were not weather balloons, and
alert pilot, Captain Clark will indicate that the objects demonstrated
peculiar behavior. On the recordings the people at LAADS indicate
they had had previous experience with similar sightings when they
state, "We process these every now and then."
All right [UNINTELLIGIBLE] [SOUNDS LIKE: WD3]
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] Uh, I'm getting some, uh, reports at Edwards tower,
Victorville tower and, uh, several radar sights about UFOs. Are, uh,
you launching any balloons out of, uh, Edwards?
Not that I know of.
I see. Well, do, uh, does Edwards have a
Edwards don't, don't have a rawinsond [radar reflector
balloon target] unit?
[SOUNDS LIKE: to send up.] So I doubt if they launched
anything. They wouldn't have no reason to.
They wouldn't have any reason to send [OVERLAPPING] balloons up ?
[OVERLAPPING] Not the weather section anyway.
Out of Edwards,
Unidentified flying saucers?
No, uh, they got no reason to launch any weather balloons.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] Edwards control tower again. The UFOB officer at
Edwards. It has been, uh, confirmed that this [UNINTELLIGIBLE]
over the field. He had, he had seen this one.
The captain at DET ONE has seen this one. I
have see it and, uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] the, uh, UFOB officer said it
appears to be an aircraft to him. It does not appear so to me.
It appears to be an aircraft?
He says it appears to be an aircraft. [SOUNDS LIKE: Approach
control has nothing on any aircraft. It's moving too slow to be
an aircraft at that altitude.
Uh, the captain at DET ONE, he doesn't seem to
think it's an aircraft either, because the lights [UNINTELLIGIBLE] .
Yeah. There's only two lights, a white and a red.
[SOUNDS LIKE: I see no green from here.]
The, uh, YOOFOB officer saw this one. He thinks it's an
airplane. I do not.
I don ' t either.
Uh, Lieutenant Fisk [SOUNDS LIKE: deputy] here. Yeah .
It's a, uh-- What do you think of it?
Well, I'll tell you. When I first saw the thing it was
approaching the base from the north and it looked like a fairly, uh,
low altitude, probably, uh, 10,000 feet and, uh, I got a good look at
it with the binoculars. It seemed to be pushing a little cloud in
front of it and I thought, uh, well, at first,
you know, looks like a rotating beacon hitting a
And, uh, but it just stays right with it. And then it, uh, :
turned, uh, a little bit, bit more westerly and gained a tremendous
amount of altitude.
[SOUNDS LIKE: LADDS?] [OVERLAPPING] Yeah.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 18
[SOUNDS LIKE: This] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] control tower, tower
observation on that last one. It was reported all [SOUNDS LIKE:
It is almost invisible now
with a naked eye.
You have any, uh, others visible around the area?
Yes, sir. I, I still have the original one. He has
moved now to approximately one four five
And estimate at 40 miles and very, very high
Right. [SOUNDS LIKE: P X A S
CLEARS THROAT] I understand you've got some UFOs.
Where, whereabouts are they?
Uh, Edwards and Victorville area.
Oh. I see. Well, I thought maybe they was over closer
No. ' Fraid not.
I got word you were [CLEARS THROAT] [SOUNDS LIKE: usin' our]
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] or something [OVERLAPPING] or other.
[OVERLAPPING] Roger. We've got, .uh, Vegas
on eliminate, eliminate here.
Uh huh. Well, what information have you got on 'em?
Not very much, except they're flashing green, red and white.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 19
Or green, red and blue or somethin'.
are there supposed to be?
I don't know what the latest count is.
[LAUGHS] And I-- It's gettin' pretty good.
Mmm. 'Course around Edwards you're liable to see most anything.
Yeah, I guess so. [LAUGHS] So anyway, we're about to
scramble a bird off on 'em. So if we could keep [SOUNDS LIKE:
Vegas as dat], we would appreciate it much.
Oh. Phoenix would like you
to pass the tracks, uh, to them. Uh,
all right. I'd, uh-- Uh, you mean our zero vellocities,]
all the ones we have recorded?
Yeah. Just, uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] Phoenix. [B.G.
'Cause if we should crump when they had to take
the interceptor they'd, uh, have the tracks.
Okay, sir. We'll, uh, we'll have them switched in.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Right.]
[SOUNDS LIKE: Release.]
It make any sense to you, what it could
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 20
No. We're in as much of the dark as
We process [WORD?] [SOUNDS
LIKE: now and
Yeah. Okay. I'll, uh, get the thing goin'
Okay. [UNINTELLIGIBLE] here now. Thanks a
Uh, San Pedro is painting them, uh, three targets, and they're all
three around 9,000 feet.
San Pedro's pickin' 'em up at
What about Boron?
Boron? We're, uh, working with them to see if we can get 'em on 'em
now. That's those three little dots out there
I'd say that, uh, there are three definite objects. It's not
weather. It's not clutter.
Uh, they, they can see the objects, but they don't see, uh, [SOUNDS
LIKE: it's not an aircraft?]
No. They can't tell what they are.
Uh. Oh. Scramble 'em.
[SOUNDS LIKE: You are scramblin' 'em] [UNINTELLIGIBLE]? [LAUGHS]
[SOUNDS LIKE: I'm curious to] find out what the hell they are.
I am too.
And you'd be within your right to scramble 'em, wouldn't you?
I don't know. [SOUNDS LIKE: Be up to me just] [WORD?] I
They're not moving [SOUNDS LIKE: hard] at all. [SOUNDS
LIKE: They did?]
They watched 'em for 30 minutes and they didn't move at all and then
all of a sudden, boom.
Oh yeah? Hmm. [SOUNDS
LIKE: What are they?]
[LAUGHS] Don't know.
Little green men?
Nobody [SOUNDS LIKE: has ever accepted these
[SOUNDS LIKE: Let's] [WORD?] a pilot in from [SOUNDS LIKE: home.]
[STAMMERS] He-- They needed special pilots [SOUNDS LIKE: for
Well, [SOUNDS LIKE: they're still thinking that] these are
Yeah. I guess those things aren't hostile, because they haven't
done anything yet. .
It's interesting to see what's gonna happen when he goes up,
takes a look at them. [SOUNDS LIKE: There's nine of 'em
[OVERLAPPING] [WORD?]. [UNINTELLIGIBLE]
[SOUNDS LIKE: Al Planer].
Roger. Alpha Lima Tech 3. Alpha Lima One getting
close? (to scramble)
He's cranked up but I think we hit a snag here. Uh--
We're checking on it right now. We'll let you know.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Uh, stand by.]
[B.G. VOICES] All, all of 'em [SOUNDS LIKE: clear now] that
the red light has stopped and they all appear to be gaining up--uh,
Is that right?
I'll go out and watch that bright one again.
Okay, sir. Uh, [SOUNDS LIKE: uh, there's], uh, three more
of 'em well south and dim.]
Okay. [OVERLAPPING] [WORD?]
[OVERLAPPING] But I still see a red light occasionally on one of them.
Where are they from that big bright one?
Beneath him and just a little bit south and there's three of 'em almost
in a straight line.
And I still see a red light occasionally from those, but not from the
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 23
[SOUNDS LIKE: It's very possible we've been] observing this
[SOUNDS LIKE: moving] all night here. Let me, uh, let me
[SOUNDS LIKE: get him back on], see if he'd, uh, if he's gettin'
the same impression from it I'm getting.
I don't like to be the only one seeing these type things.
This is Sgt. Sorrels again. Base Ops confirms my, uh, what I'm
seeing. They are all rising and
they, there's a weather man in base ops that's been
observing these things all night
[SOUNDS LIKE: with the, uh],
uh-- He's been using reference points to, uh, try to judge --if
they were moving
And, uh, he confirmed that
they are very much higher now than they were. They are, they are
definitely going up.
Any estimate on the altitude now?
Uh, with-- I'd hate to venture a guess. Uh, I-- I
would say something like, uh, maybe at 30, 40,000. But now this
is strictly way out [SOUNDS LIKE: there in] [WORD?] off the
And none of 'em are at low altitude any more then?
No, sir. I wouldn't say. No, uh, not nearly what they were.
At, at first sighting on that one I would, I would have guessed his
altitude to be no more than, at the most, 5,000 feet.
These division reports have had them anywhere from all the way from 30
or 40 grand.
Well, uh, they were very accurate. We got-- We'd get height
on the same track at, uh, 6,000.
These are tower guys.
Oh yeah. They, they admit it.
[LAUGHS] In fact one
guy says, "I don't like to be the only guy that sees this stuff."
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] So he went to get somebody else. Now they've got
a weather man out there lookin' at 'em and they've got, uh, the , tower
people lookin' at 'em and, uh, March approach has 'em on radar and
Pedro, and, uh, Boron--
We just heard Sergeant Chuck Sorrels say, "I don't like to be the
one seeing these type things." But he kept observing them.
And we will hear him help vector the F-106 interceptor called Alpha
Lima towards the luminous objects above the Edwards
runway. The F-106 was equipped with the MA-1 fire control
system and SAGE computer direction center, connected to the air defense
network. This achieved automatic target lock on. But the
pilot could still manually fire his weapons. Listen carefully to
the voice of the interceptor pilot pursuing the object and stating,
"Contact, " indicating that he had actual radar contact with
Uh, roger. This the [McLean???] again the WD
from Tech 3. Listen, on this bird that has
just taken off. It's-- It's not a hot
No. No. He's, he's cold.
Yeah. He's cold and he's, uh,
No. He's not loaded.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] [SOUNDS LIKE: aircraft.]
Okay. Is he aware of, now, of what he's gonna be
everything? How pleased is he?
Oh, uh, he didn't say
Okay. Edwards tower?
WD. Okay. Alpha Lima Zero One is now
nine five for 15. [OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: If--]
[OVERLAPPING] You have him in sight.
You him in
Uh, Edwards, do you still have any of these, uh, UFOBs
tower, pick out one you want us to intercept and we'll take
ah Zero One in on him.
That's-- Have him, have
him, uh, proceed, uh.
He appears] to be goin' on
north now.] Uh, have him come, uh, right down the runway, uh,
Alpha Lima Zero One. Uh,
would you, uh, turn
your running lights on?
Yeah. Roger, Zero
One. Uh, turn your, uh, lights on.
Lights are on.]
Right. Alpha Lima Zero
One, starboard three six zero.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Roger,
three six oh.]
[SOUNDS LIKE: Okay.]
Alpha Lima Zero One, uh, starboard zero four zero.
Zero One's coming down to zero four zero runway.
Let him go right over our
rocket site. Start a slow right
right over the rocket sight.
Okay. He's turning
Okay. How's he looking
now? I got him starboard to one
Uh, hold that.
Hold that, huh?
Yeah. That's pretty good.
Okay. Could you--
What, uh? What's the blip in
relation to him, 12 o'clock?
about-- Have him more
Uh, if you have him-- Uh, the best reference I'm gonna be
able to get is have him come back over Edwards and
line up with the
Ground observer requests you
fly down the zero four zero runway.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] the runway.
Alpha Lima Zero One, when you
reach the end of the runway,
zero nine zero at the end of the runway.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] or [SOUNDS
LIKE: departure lane?]
Zero One, you should
hold a one blip now, target on
your right. One on your left. Stand by for
range. XXXXX negative ? reads from targets.
One on the right and one on
Contact, uh, standby one, I
have possible contact at, uh, rise
possible contact rise on
about ten nine 20.
Roger. A pursuit
LIKE: Zero five zero.]
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] Can you hold
that target, uh, approximately, uh,
left at 17
LIKE: The description of this object?
I'd like to try and get it eyeballed if it's out here.
Roger, uh, should be
approximately, or was approximately five
to seven objects, uh, green, red and white flashing lights. Uh, they
were swiftly moving and seemed to be in the area for some time and then
moved straight up.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] on my target.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] and, uh,
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] target and,
Roger, uh, we had a
possible radar contact
now a range of three
miles. We're losing contact with that object now.
Starboard.] Zero five zero.
Zero One's heading should pass
over Edwards tower.
I see Edwards, uh, from here.
LIKE: Target area, uh,] two miles.
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] I have
[WORD?] another one, a flashing target about,
Roger, uh, could you, uh,
check this target out?
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] he's flying
low out there.
Roger. Uh, Zero One,
begin descent to intercept this target.
Uh, Zero One, Edwards
tower. He reports you, uh, are in the
vicinity of his target now.
What did he find out there to
He lost his contact..
Uh, I still have a contact out
Oh, you do? A visual?
Is it one of these
objects? Look the same as the rest of 'em?
No. This one, uh, just
appears to be, uh, flashing, not, uh,
nothing red or green involved.
Oh, I see. Could be
All right. I have Alpha
Lima in sight now.
Yeah. He says he's got a
contact 12 o'clock
Turn your heighth finder uh,
seven degrees ahead of him.
How's he lookin' now? Is
he headin' for anything?
He looks good.
Yeah. Are the blimps
merging? I mean,
Yes. [SOUNDS LIKE:
He's converging on 'em.] Uh, they
are converging. He sees to be maybe just a
little bit south of it. A left turn, left turn. Low
left turn. He's low and left. That thing is rising.
Uh, tower, how's things look
Uh, he's low.
Look-- Search high. Search high.
[B.C. BUZZER] Search
very high. That thing is rising.
It's rising rapidly.
It looks like it's right above
him from the tower now.
It, it looks
almost directly above him and rising.
Okay. Pedro, come back
to [OVERLAPPING] the target.
Back [SOUNDS LIKE: to
You're in the general vicinity
now. [OVERLAPPING] It looks much
higher. Much higher.
[OVERLAPPING] It's directly
Okay. Alpha Lima's gonna
climb to 40,000.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Low
contact at zero three zero.]
I'll hold zero three
zer-- Search, uh, 15 degrees either side,
zero three zero.
Okay, tower, turning Alpha
Lima Zero One towards at two five zero,
should, uh, bring him straight in over the top of you.
LIKE: Over the top of us again?]
[SOUNDS LIKE: Okay.]
[SOUNDS LIKE: He looks
like he's still holding] two-five thousand.
Right. And, uh--
Zero thousand now.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Say again?]
He's climbing to 40,000.
Uh, one of the objects is to
his right, low.
To his right and
[SOUNDS LIKE: Search
visually right and low.
Uh, [CLEARS THROAT] Pedro
search, mark that
spot. Check, uh--
[SOUNDS LIKE: five
degrees, either side of that height finder
and, uh, look high and low.
Okay. Have him come
right, uh-- Have him line up with my
runway zero four. Have him go on a right turn and, uh, roll out
zero four zero and bring him right down my runway.
You're gonna do what now?
Right turn. And roll out
zero four zero. Come right down my
Okay. Realize his turn
radius up there's about, uh, 20 miles.
Uh, that'll put him to the
north of it when he comes around.
Okay. Uh, put him, uh,
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] starboard at starboard
turn zero four zero.
Zero one turning starboard
zero four zero.
Make sure bring him in, uh,
quite a ways north of ya.
Yes. He will.
We'll prob'ly lose him when he goes over the
tower and have to catch him on, uh--]
I've got a possible contact on
search radar, bearing this near station
zero seven five to ten.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Hey,
[SOUNDS LIKE: Zero seven] five ten.
Uh, is there anything else
I have one at zero seven
five. Uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE] the distance.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Rog.]
It's high. [UNINTELLIGIBLE] what heading's the interceptor on now?
He's at zero eight zero heading.
Okay. Hold that.
Uh, [WORD?] how's he lining up?
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 31
Looks pretty good.
Luminous object 12 o'clock.
Should be 12 o'clock. 20 degrees [SOUNDS LIKE: fourth] and
high, [OVERLAPPING] high.
[OVERLAPPING] At zero five zero.
He appears [B.G. BUZZER] he's way low.
We're at 40,000
He 's still low.
I would say he was about under it, now.
Uh, he should be under it now.
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: Or he should be--]
[OVERLAPPING] Did he pass under a target at this' time?
Yes. He's-- About the time I said mark, uh, he appeared
that he was almost under it.
Okay. Mark that spot there,
Okay. Search, uh, ten degrees either side.
Mmm. All Zero One reports is one great
big bright, shiny star.
That's what it appears like from the tower now. Uh, it has that
appearance here now. It is much, much higher than when we
first, uh, first observed it.
If it's that much higher we're not gonna see it on
the search radar.
I suspect it's over your radar now.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 32
Was that-- Is that in the area of this this target you're
Right. [SOUNDS LIKE: This is the search. PPI.
That is the three PPI search area?
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: Yeah. We have the interceptor
at another base now. We're gonna have it on another target]
[UNINTELLIGIBLE]. Zero One zero zero.
[B.G. LAUGHTER] . Hey, tower?
Have you got anything else in sight?
No, sir. Just those two that we tried on there. Uh, and he
appears from the tower to pass way beneath it.
Uh, Edwards? Yes, sir.
Is there one about, uh, southeast of you, about, uh, three miles at
Southeast at three?
Yes. Southeast, much closer. We've got a possible contact
there on something.
Just a moment. I see something. Let me throw
my glasses on.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 33
Three one two zero.
Huh. [SOUNDS LIKE: Sir, I] hate to be an optimist, but that
fighter looks like he's goin' someplace.
Right. Did you find anything back in that search area I gave you?
I don't have any
Okay. You lost all your other visual contacts on
Okay. We'll call Alpha Lima Zero One then.
[OVERLAPPING] [SOUNDS LIKE: I don't--]
[OVERLAPPING] [UNINTELLIGIBLE] curiosity, anyway.
Yes, uh. I don't have another one in sight. Uh, [SOUNDS
You've lost 'em all, huh?
Sir, I don't have [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
Zero One said he saw some reflections off the ground that appear to be
Reflections off the ground that appear to be flashing?
Right, uh, off a lake
Huh. Well, I don't know what [SOUNDS LIKE: that'd be.
No. He knows the beacons. Okay, fine. I might as well
key off and break this line down then.
We'll see you tomorrow night.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 34
[SOUNDS LIKE: Off surveillance here.]
[CLEARS THROAT] [SOUNDS LIKE: Right.]
Are you gonna debrief, uh, Alpha Lima?
Yeah. I've been listening in on the air here on my, uh, [SOUNDS
LIKE: little IND monitor.]
You gonna debrief him when he lands?
3 WD3. You wanted to know our results of Alpha Lima Zero One?
[SOUNDS LIKE: Didn't get] results, huh?
No. We picked up a low flying aircraft, a few ground targets and
things like that.
I'll be doggone.
[SOUNDS LIKE: When he went through at 15, 25 and 40 thousand
these visual objects and, uh, [SOUNDS LIKE: supposedly he got]
under it, according ....
to, uh, ground observations,
[OVERLAPPING] Uh huh.
[OVERLAPPING] visual observations. And, uh, pilot reported
nothing flying underneath it.
Uh huh. Okay. Well, thanks very much. It was kind'a
Yeah, it is. We're as curious as you are.
Guess we'll never know. [LAUGHS]
Yeah, [LAUGHS] I guess not.
[SOUNDS LIKE: Okay.]
Okay. Well, thanks
Uh, one of the telephone people that work here knew about this deal
last night. He was reacting to this UFO report. And he
[OVERLAPPING] Yeah, uh, [UNINTELLIGIBLE], please?
Well, this fella went into a restaurant in Lancaster this morning and
apparently he knew a waitress in there and he [SOUNDS LIKE:
hadn't ment-- mentioned anything at all] about this UFO thing and she
was tellin' him about a guy that came in there last night all shook
up. Said he was on the highway between Victorville and, uh, uh,
Lancaster. [B.G. BUZZER] It's, oh, roughly about 20 miles,
[SOUNDS LIKE: Uh,] [UNINTELLIGIBLE]--
East of, uh, Palmdale here on [SOUNDS LIKE: 130 E].
[SOUNDS LIKE: Oh.]
And he said this [STAMMERS] bright red object, uh, he saw it kind'a
hoverin', all of a sudden it made a pass right down over his car and
right across the highway and said it's parallel to the
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 36
highway for quite a while and then just took off and it like scared him
bad. He thought it was gonna hit the car.
Holy mackerel. [LAUGHS] Uh--
[LAUGHS] [SOUNDS LIKE: Yeah, and now--]
Well, he was the
telephone man you say?
No. It-- [OVERLAPPING] This
[OVERLAPPING] Oh, one of the telephone men overheard him?
No. The telephone man, uh, was talkin' to this
waitress in the
w-- restaurant this [OVERLAPPING] morning,
About six o'clock over in Lancaster.
And [SOUNDS LIKE: I've got] the telephone man's name here.
Uh, Watch Supervisor and XXXX director?
Uh,-we have the UFO information dispatcher at base operations Norton on
also. He's listening in now.
Oh. Oh. Goo-- Good. Good. [OVERLAPPING] Uh,
then he needs this more than I do. Uh,
this the, uh, Watch Supervisor?
Yes. This is the Watch Supervisor at Los Angeles Center.
[OVERLAPPING] Lancaster-- Hello?
If this is the Lancaster area, uh, we're supposed to refer you to the
nearest base where this, uh, sighting occurred, which would be Edwards
Okay.. Well, you won't need this report then?
Well, uh, that's, uh, the way we have it written up here is an SOP,
uh. Supposed to determine the location where
the sighting took place
[OVERLAPPING] Sure. .
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 37
[OVERLAPPING] and, uh, refer you, rather, refer the party to report
to the nearest base [OVERLAPPING] where
the sighting occurred, which would be Edwards or, uh, George,
Yeah. Okay. . . .
Uh, now this is [SOUNDS LIKE: a deputy in between] again. Uh, did this
occur though, close to [SOUNDS LIKE: Cajon] Pass, where he saw this?
Yes. Uh huh.
The actual sighting occurred at the Cajon Pass?
It was right down below Cajon Pass.
You mean on the, uh, on the, uh, north side of the mountain?
Yes. This is on the north side of the mountain. I'll, I'll
be glad to pass it up to Edwards. I, I was just [OVERLAPPING]
kind of [WORD?]--
[OVERLAPPING] I, I could give you the name of the, uh, YOOFO officer at
Edwards. I have it on my report here. Let's see, uh, it's
Captain, uh-- Wait'll I find the damn thing. Uh, what's
that, uh, captain's name at Edwards?
Now, that's okay. Uh, uh, uh--
[OVERLAPPING] He, he'd want it there a--at, uh, the [SOUNDS LIKE:
WD or SD] position for your report or not?
[OVERLAPPING] Uh, no. I won't need it here. Uh, but, uh, Captain Bilent
at Edwards, uh, Base Ops.
Uh huh. Yeah. Okay. [SOUNDS LIKE: Well, I'll
give it to him. ]
[OVERLAPPING] He'd, he'd be, uh, collecting all of this data.
[OVERLAPPING] Yeah. Okay. [WORD?]--
[OVERLAPPING] And I think [SOUNDS LIKE: it's a real] interesting
thing. I think he prob'ly would want to have it.
SIGHTINGS/ SEGMENT AF-1471 38
Y-- Yeah. I'll pass it on to him.
All right. Fine. Thank you.
You bet. [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. ...
Okay, uh, [SOUNDS LIKE: watch supervisor]?
Okay. Thank you very--
At, uh, Edwards.